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From: NewRyan
Date: Mon Aug 15 22:51:04 MST 2005 Subject: God as Father, Me as Son

Responses
MaryKay: Childhood (8/15/05)
clrclady: Thoughts (8/15/05)
Karen: Blighted family tree (8/16/05)
benjipark: response (8/16/05)
Responses (sorted by date)
benjipark: response (8/16/05)
Karen: Blighted family tree (8/16/05)
clrclady: Thoughts (8/15/05)
MaryKay: Childhood (8/15/05)

“Why is it so hard for us to trust God to be our Father?

God is invisible.
God is silent.
Where has he been in the past when tragic things have happened?
God doesn’t have a physical body to see and touch like our earthy dad’s do. God doesn’t have a physical voice to listen to, or a face to converse with. We can’t go outside and play catch with God or go out to dinner and a movie with him. Certainly there are some challenges to this relationship.

Yet, if I’m honest with myself I think I have to admit that the problem lies more with me than with God. The trick is not to get God to behave like a Father. The difficulty lies in my unwillingness to act like a son.

Since God in his essence is fatherly, he must therefore be parenting us even we when don’t realize it or refuse to acknowledge it. God is really good at being a parent. This is just what he does. It’s who he is.

Me on the other hand, I don’t have a clue about what it means to be a kid. I’ve spent most of my life looking out for myself. I was really left to figure life out on my own from a pretty young age. My parents divorced and I tried to keep my family from totally falling apart (what was I thinking?). I tried to take care of my mom. I tried to look out for my brother and sister. I tried to not think too hard about how my dad wasn’t around much. Then after a long time of this, I just gave up. I couldn’t do it. I wasn’t supposed to. I was just a kid. But out of all this I’ve made some definite conclusions about myself and God.

Now I’m 26 years old and God’s asking me to be a kid. Really for the first time. I feel like I should be trying to figure out what it means to be a man and God wants me to figure out how to be a kid. Funny how God works.

Eric tells me what God really wants is to be in relationship with me. He wants to be in on my struggles and fears. He wants to be in conversation with me. He wants me to trust him even in the midst of being inadequate and scared.
To be a child in the care of a good parent means to first of all not be alone. I don’t have to look out for myself because God is. It also means he’s guiding me and protecting me.

But how do I do all this? I’ve been running from God for so long…even my best days with him are shot through with trying so hard not to screw up- so he won’t leave me. Or I’ll ask God for something I really want, but then I spend my time trying to be the good little boy- trying to figure out what he wants me to do so that I can get what I want.

But this is not how the world is. God gives me good things because he really cares for me, not because I’ve been sufficiently good. God hangs around me because he wants to, not because I’ve done enough to please him. To live like this is true would really change so much for me. Standing here now, looking at how I’ve done life for so long, how I’ve tried to relate to God, it feels like the doorway to another life entirely.

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From: MaryKay
Date: Mon Aug 15 07:45:02 MST 2005 Subject: Childhood

Ryan, thank you for sharing your thoughts and helping me take a closer look at my beliefs about God the Father and myself as His child. I too have been struggling to understand how to be a "grown up" and stop being the victim of my childhood. It is so exciting to realize I'm really being called into enjoying what my childhood should have been. A time to be nurtured, loved, protected and adored. Sounds very inviting! Leaning into that thought brings me the picture of myself as a little girl standing on my Father's feet while He holds me tight and twirls me around the room. I think I'm falling in love!!!

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From: clrclady
Date: Mon Aug 15 13:44:50 MST 2005 Subject: Thoughts

Thanks for sharing that Ryan. I have also frequently struggled with the idea of God as Father. And I am trying to be a child for the first time myself. A few things that have been said to me lately which relate are: the covenant of peace that God talks about the word peace relates to be in the womb, God is calling us to a place of comfort, of being nurtured, of being cared for. Also, we cannot get it wrong. Sue told me this the other day. I cannot get it wrong. Jesus has already covered everything in my life and I just need to live with Him, be wtih Him. I cannot get it wrong. That is an amazing thing. I do not know if I believe it yet, but it makes since.

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From: Karen
Date: Mon Aug 15 17:21:33 MST 2005 Subject: Blighted family tree

Thanks for sharing, Ryan.

Once you get into a pattern of thinking about yourself as alone in the world (and acting on those thoughts, of course), it seems hard, if not impossible, to break out of it. For me, there's always been the issue of healthy independence vs. stubborn self-reliance. I don't know if the word is "balancing" so much as "discerning"--discerning between the two and walking away from the stubborn foolishness. It has filtered into so many levels of my life. Especially in the U.S., we seem to define adulthood as the ability to be independent and competent at a lot of things. We neglect or resist a healthy dependence on others and on God and may actively avoid stepping into a situation where independence may not be an option. But there's a paradox here: being childlike (willing to be nurtured as well as to nurture, not needing to have the front of having it "all together," admitting you're still on the path, you've still got a lot of growing and living to do and actually, that's OK) will somehow allow you to function fully as a "grownup." As more present in your choices. As more of who you are.

As many of you know, I have had a good (at times very uncomfortable, but when push comes to shove, trustworthy) relationship w/my earthly father. But, on the other hand...

I have had a miserable relationship with *his* father, a man who's never wanted much, if anything, to do with me, unless I was totally convenient but, more likely, actively kissed up to him, which I always refused to. I spent over a decade (God showed me this summer, 25 years, to be precise) trying to convince myself, oh well, I guess I didn't need him, and I actually believed there wasn't much, if any, pain left under all these years of resignation. (Several close friends did see through my denial. Hmmm.)

This summer, I finally allowed myself to feel the grief of my grandfather's betrayal. He abandoned us all, over and over again: father, mother, sisters, and me. Conveniently bundled with this betrayal was the lesson he's taught his entire life, in words and actions: "You must take care of yourself. When the **** hits the fan, no one else will." I sat at his dining room table a month and a half ago (first time I'd seen him in many years) and he flat-out told me, if you come to me for help in a crisis, you won't get it...just the end of my gun....because you haven't done what I think you should do.

It is hard for the truth of Grace to overcome these dark lessons. But after my trip to see my grandfather, God reminded me--through his son, my father--that I have chosen, for many years, to submit my fate to Christ. And that I do believe in his Grace. And as I submit to God, I must also allow my earthly dad to take care of me in ways he has offered, without believing the lie that it means I've "failed" as an adult, or the other lie that he disdains me as less successful (as my grandfather would do)--my father is not this way. And God is DEFINITELY not this way.

For weeks, I've been thinking about that line from "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe," someone asking about that very powerful looking lion, "Is Aslan safe?"

The answer: "Safe, no--but he is good."

Does God, as my father, promise safety? Not in the U.S. sense of the word: pain-free, accident-free, setback-free, physical death-free. But this is something I can't really ensure myself anyway...at best, I'd create the illusion of safety, like my grandfather has done, piling up block after block to form an ugly pile, gun after gun in a line, the lunacy of the Cold War encompassed in one man's sad house. Bleecccch.

I must continue to reject Grandpa's bunker mentality and choose growing up instead, growing up into life. Grieving when need be, but not being defined by others' abandonment/rejection of me.

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From: benjipark
Date: Mon Aug 15 19:44:33 MST 2005 Subject: response

Thanks for sharing Ryan. --insert whitty and iluminated responce here--

.......

Oh well...

I'll just have to stick with thanks for sharing.

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